UTG INTERVIEW: Chuckie Campbell Discusses ‘More Die Of Heartbreak’

Buffalo, NY emcee Chuckie Campbell just dropped his new full-length, More Die Of Heartbreak, in December to wrap up 2013 and start the new year with an updated catalog for listeners to absorb.

Campbell took a break from his hectic schedule of writing and teaching to speak with us in depth about the new album, the influences that aided in its creation, and some of the people that helped bring it all together. If you’re unfamiliar with Chuckie Campbell, we suggest reading through the break to get acquainted with a truly intelligent and talented individual that’ll be making bigger waves in the hip-hop scene in 2014.

It seems to be increasingly rare that you come across a rapper these days that goes by his given name. Is there any particular reason you choose to waive the opportunity to go by any moniker you wanted for this project?

My legal name is Charles Campbell. Chuckie Campbell is a nickname that followed me through my early years and into adulthood, so I developed it into a pen name. Some of my early fiction writing published in literary journals such as Our Stories, Word Riot, and The 2ndhand use the name. I first acquired it at a youth basketball game and it stuck, so instead of fighting it, I went with it, and it stayed with me through high school, college, and now into my professional life.

Did you grow up with hip-hop at all? What initially inspired you to get involved with the genre? When did you fully realize that this is what you wanted to do?

Yes, hip hop as a youth was enormously influential. There really wasn’t a point where I decisively said, “I think I like rap, so I’m going to do it,” or, “graffiti and street art interests me, so that is what I want to put my energy into,” or, “I want to wear my clothes this way, because the girls would like it”; it was more along the lines of this is the culture and lifestyle of my upbringing, what I’m surrounded by — the music, the dialect, the clothes, the style of dance, the philosophy — and that also, is an integral part of who I am, a mode of thinking, a way of seeing the world.

In an abstract sense, hip hop was the cultural paradigm that I filtered everything through, but it was my entry point into the world of ideas. Without going too far here, I’d say without a doubt that not only did I grow up with hip hop, but it became the reason for wanting to learn, to read and interact with artifacts of knowledge, and that opened other doors. I first started rapping when I was about 12 years old, but it never came to fruition until now. And there are a lot of reasons for that.

So there’s a lot I want to ask regarding your new album. First, the title, More Die Of Heartbreak, was borrowed from and directly inspired by Saul Bellow’s novel of the same name, right? The book deals with very real themes of worldviews, fate, and family. Would you say that these themes directly relate to the material on your album?

Bellow’s novel, more than anything, was only inspiration for my title. My album explores many themes throughout, but it definitely works on some intersecting issues such as heartbreak, suicide, domestic violence, substance abuse, city life, and racism, which are also contrasted with messages of hope, creativity, and inspiration, but overall, it doesn’t borrow character, description, or attempt any real mimicry of the elements found in the novel itself. Bellow’s work has been of interest to me since I read Herzog, another novel of his, some time ago. More Die of Heartbreak followed and I always liked the title; plus, it fit with the album’s content and the sum of emotional experience in my own life. When I lifted the title, though, I wanted to do it in a way that honored the literary works of a terrific writer and man who championed the human heart.

Judging by your lyrics and ideals throughout your album, I would peg you for a very intellectual guy, and you mentioned hip-hop kind of being a gateway for wanting to learn. Would you consider yourself well-educated? And how do you feel that your knowledge affects your writing and overall musical abilities?

Hip hop was my gateway into most of my intellectual and/or academic endeavors; if it weren’t for hip hop I wouldn’t be the man I am today (from an ideological perspective and possibly others), and growing up in poverty, in the environment I grew up in, I watched others waste away through drug use, or serve long sentences in prison, steal and cheat one another, take other peoples’ lives, or their own. There’s not a lot of ways out of that kind of environment or really the mindset that comes with it. Hip hop, along with a little luck and some athletic scholarships, helped move me away from my surroundings, and that became the key to expanding my worldview.

I hold a B.A. in Communications with an emphasis in Public Relations and a minor in Religion from Lee University, an M.A. in English and Creative Writing from Eastern Kentucky University, and a Ph.D. in English Literature and Creative Writing from the University of Southern Mississippi. Currently, I teach college English and public speaking at Bryant & Stratton College in downtown Buffalo, NY.

I’m sure that my background is a bit different than my contemporaries, but I began in much the same place they did — writing past the margins in my notepad, battling at small clubs, rhyming and doing spoken word in coffee shops, earning respect on street corners, etc. — but now, my work has extended to helping people rise against the forces that hold them back. I’d like to think that my album is detailing that struggle, letting the listener be a fly on the wall as I walk them through my experiences, step by step. I’ve done a lot in my life, good and bad, but none of it came without struggle, without reconciling ideology with the real world, without seeing death and despair and hurt, without some kind of heartbreak. I’m concerned with giving that a voice. I’m more concerned with the social and emotional intelligence of the listener and how I can touch them through story, translate feeling, connect, give them something creative that is worth their time.

You’ve dedicated the album to a friend of yours that passed away in 2011. Are there any specific tracks or lyrics on the album that are directly influenced by or at Ralph?

“Deus Ex Machina” is the piece that truly details that whole ordeal. That song is the eye of the storm that holds the album together. It describes growing up in poverty, my cultural and interpersonal influences, my befriending of one of my best friends and adolescent mentor, Ralph Prater, how that relationship disintegrated after I was assaulted by him in 2004, and his suicide seven years later. During that seven years, after the assault, I stopped rapping and Ralph and I didn’t communicate. All of this is me trying to make sense of what happened. Ralph was one of my closest friends and suffered from sometimes what could be described as violent manic episodes, despite being, still to this day, one of the smartest and most articulate people I’ve ever met. The assault broke my jaw in two places and I still have two metal plates in my face; during the altercation I never fought back or retaliated. He had no idea what he was doing in those moments. After, I had to have reconstructive facial surgery.

We wrote many songs together, and the first song on this album, “Speak,” is actually one we wrote and recorded together in 1999, but which Willie Breeding and I resurrected for this project; the second verse was originally written and performed by Ralph Prater, but I re-did it for this record. For me, it seemed like the best way to start everything, as a beginning place in the story. “Deus Ex Machina,” meaning God in the Machine, by definition, is a plot device whereby a seeming unsolvable problem is suddenly and abruptly resolved by the contrived and unexpected intervention of some new event, character, ability or object, which in the song, is manifested by Prater’s suicide, a self inflicted gunshot to the head, as narrated at the end of the song. In many ways, this event in the narrative of my own life acts as that plot device.

Growing up, Ralph had a hard life, and most everyone around him knew that; despite being extremely gifted, there weren’t the safety nets there for him like there were for other people. I think a lot of other people go through that every day; it is their lives, but their voices aren’t heard. He lived with his grandfather and his father was absent. His mother struggled and he always tried to help her, but there were other reasons why that was difficult. When one thing went wrong, everything snowballed into a larger issue, because no one was there to help out. I think Ralph Prater died of a broken heart. I wish he were here if only for a moment to share with him. He was one of my best friends and I miss him. In the end, the album serves as a reminder that for every one person who makes it out alive, more will die of heartbreak.

I’m always intensely interested in album art so naturally I was curious about the artwork for More Die Of Heartbreak. Obviously it’s a take on The Vitruvian Man but can you tell us more about it? Where does the image come from and why did you choose to use it for your work?

All of the album art was done by Kerby Rosanes, an incredibly talented artist out of the Philippines who runs Sketchy Stories and Doodle Art Illustration. The CD package is illustrated with a ten panel lyric booklet insert inside a DVD case with Kerby’s intricate and delightful illustrations throughout. I had this idea of the emergent themes of the album growing out of The Vitruvian Man, as if these were the different and divergent parts or narratives that made it all come together proportionally to make up a human being. I sent 8 or 9 of the songs to Kerby and he started working. I can’t say enough about his professionalism and willingness to work with me. I can be a demanding and complicated person to work with because I have very particular visions for what I want; Kerby delivered promptly and was there for whatever the job entailed. I have a feeling you’ll be hearing more about him.

Willie Breeding comes from a country rock duo but he took the reins on production for the album which seems like an odd choice ostensibly. How did you come to work with him and how did you know that he could handle a hip-hop release?

Willie and I have been working together really since the beginning, almost 15 or more years. He recorded and produced some of the very early stuff Ralph and I did back in the late 90s and early 2000s, so even knowing that he sings, writes, and produces country music (which I think makes it more impressive), he’s still not a stranger to hip hop in the least, and musically, he possesses a unique understanding of texture, progression, cadence, songwriting, and the like, which I think is important to the sound we create when we’re working together. The whole thing is a true collaboration; we work together and he gives an honest proper treatment to things. Every beat — at least this is how I picture his work — there’s a kind of conversation, a discourse happening between sounds, how the drums are interacting with the bassline, how the keys are talking to those elements, and there’s a darkness to all of that, which gives it added character.

He’s also more than a producer. On top of giving excellent advice and being a great friend, he studies art and is dedicated to the craft of songwriting. Sometimes, I am simply in awe of what he does with The Breedings, and I really can’t imagine having that much talent in one family. Really, I can never say enough about Willie, because for what he does, there’s nothing that could sum it all up. There would never be a More Die of Heartbreak without Willie Breeding.

Now, let’s talk about the guest spots. You’ve got some impressive names on some tracks here. What can you share about who you worked with vocally and how you came to be in the studio together?

The album features highly notable guest appearances from members of the Wu-Tang Clan, Cappadonna and Solomon Childs, Cole Jonique of Tate Music Group, Willie and Erin Breeding of The Breedings, as well as rapper and producer for Disturbia Music Group, Block McCloud. Of these collaborations, Erin Breeding and Willie Breeding were most likely the easiest to recruit, as they are consistently working together and Willie was producing the album. Willie appears on “How To Know When,” with this amazing chorus that he sent to me almost a year ago. He recorded the whole thing in Nashville, TN. It was so good I didn’t know what to do with it at first. It wasn’t until later that I laid the vocals for my part in Buffalo, NY and sent it his way. Erin appears on “More Die of Heartbreak,” the title track, which seems to be a fan favorite, thus far. Erin kind of takes you off guard with how good she is because she’s such a powerful singer. Even live, she has a kind of dynamic singing presence that exudes something deep and honest, something in the eyes and delivery that makes everything feel true.

My work with Block McCloud began with my contribution on his mixtape Demons and Angels Vol. 2, a dedication to BAYZ BZA who passed December 1, 2011; Bayz made a number of beats before he passed that will be used on the mixtape, a project that will feature a ton of underground and established artists. It should come out in 2014 through Disturbia Music Group. After laying a verse, I reached out to Block for the chorus on “Against the Grain,” and he showed major love by coming through. My work with Cappadonna came after, and mainly through Solomon Childs, who I’ve built a relationship with over the past two years through a friend of mine. “Against the Grain” was one of the last songs we finished on More Die of Heartbreak, just because it was recorded in fragments instead of one big session.

Cole Jonique of Tate Music Group on “All I Meant,” came through connections Willie Breeding had. Her voice was so soulful and touching, and I wanted a female on the track to give it the feeling of dialogue between man and woman. We reached out and she delivered. Look for Cole’s album Pieces of Me, if you like what you hear on “All I Meant.”

I am more than grateful to have associated and worked with this talented group of people, and in some circles, I’m aware that these guest spots help legitimize the music for listeners who’ve never heard of me. That’s always a good thing.

So now that the album has been released and is being well-received, do you already have another release in mind, or in the works even?

I’ve already started writing, but I haven’t recorded anything, yet. However, people won’t be without music; there’s a lot of stuff we did, but didn’t release, so there will be some extras to look forward to, until we drop something else that is full length. More than anything, I’d like to get out and perform, do more shows, and connect with those who haven’t heard what we do.

Outside of this project, you have a lot of other endeavors going on, right? Teaching, as you mentioned, but also poems, short stories, Sunsets and Silencers. Tell us about what else you have on your plate.

Aside from music and writing, generally, I teach college English and public speaking as a full-time professor at Bryant & Stratton College in downtown Buffalo, NY, where I am the chair of the English committee and the advisor for The Voice, a student-run newspaper for the Buffalo campus. I also run Sunsets & Silencers, an online and print journal for the arts, and in my spare time, I am a skills coach for high school junior varsity and varsity basketball at Nichols Prep School. From time to time, I speak for the Stop the Violence Coalition in Buffalo, NY.

Have you been playing any shows or have plans to take the new material on the road?

Recently, we had an album release show and video screening at Jerzees in Richmond, KY, but in the future, getting the music to the people is the number one priority; you can expect more shows and live performances in the new year, especially in the New York area.

You ended 2013 with a bang by dropping this album, so what do you have in store for the new year? Any particular goals that you’re looking to obtain with this project?

First, as an artist, I’d like to thank underthegunreview.net for this opportunity. It means a lot to get to weigh in on what’s going on with this album. As for my particular goals on this project, my hope is to legitimize the music to new listeners, grow the ever-expanding army of followers, and give back to music what it has given to me — purpose and community.

 

Written and conducted by: Brian Lion – Follow him on Twitter

Brian Leak
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